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In this Discussion
- CeffylDwr September 2019
- Haltanny September 2019
- HTRanch September 2019
- NorthernStars September 2019
- SpryOfJune September 2019
- SummertreeFarms September 2019
Managing White Factor W2, S and Frame
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I've come to understand that a couple of my favorite patterns that pop up, Overo and Marble/Paper Mache, happen because of w2, S and Frame. For folks less afraid of white factors than usual, what techniques do you use to manage a combination like this? Do you just hope for luck that foals don't go lethal white? Really want to develop this line but also cringing at the idea of losing even one foal.

G3ESBA MysteryBox PosDPKP
FavSH PainttheFence
FavSH Paint The Fence
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Well... I personally wouldn't ever cross two frame horses... ever. Hom frame is lethal (minus freaky Friday's), and it's not worth it to me. W2 is lethal with almost everything Kit, so I avoid it when possible. The ONLY time I accept W2 is if it's on a leopard foal I absolutely love. Then I'll keep it, because I can breed it out, GMT it off, or not worry too much because it's only mixed with appy. Frame, I'll happily breed. But I usually only keep mares with it, and ensure my stallions don't have it. My alt, YarbroughFarms, is actually breeding DP horses (mostly livers and chocolate palominos, but a few DP bays), and most of my 2g mares are splash frames. I love them. My foundation stallion is splash frame, liver. I won him in a contest, so I use him wisely, and with caution. My 2g stallion(s) must not be frame, due to the fact I have several frame mares.Love,
Chase ♡Thanked by 1Looper -
Most people who dabble with Frame at least in my experience will have it either only on the mares or only on the studs so they don't have to worry about getting a hom Frame horse. Trying to keep the white factor to minimal or light can help too. W2 is always pretty much a luck of the draw when paired with anything.Dabbler in EVERYTHING.Thanked by 1Looper
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My advice is to brush up on punnet squares. That way, you can figure out the chances of parents throwing lethal combinations. For example, when crossing two horses who are heterozygous frame, using a punnet square you would find that you will have a 25% chance of a horse with no frame, a 50% chance of a live heterozyous frame foal, and a 25% chance of frame lethality.
As for mixing Kit genes, I had a mini project going on for a while where I purposefully bred high lethality Kit genes together to see how high I could get the white factor before losing foals. I mainly used w1, w2, w3, and w10 (if you haven't come across one yet, Kitw3Kitw2 is a gorgeous combo). I didn't introduce much frame or splash, but I found that with just the risky Kit gene combination, I could get up to minimal or medium white factor without losing foals.
My suggestion is to keep either splash or frame out of your stallions, as those genes will increase white factor even more. Alternatively, come up with a good prefix or tattoo system so you know what mares and stallions not to mix (I would keep the splash and/or frame to one parent only).
In addition, only keep stallions with a white factor of minimal or none to keep the white patterning down in foals.
Good luck! I really enjoyed my "lethal project" and was sad when I had to sell off the line. Everyone loses foals in-game every once in a while, so don't feel bad about it.ID 43830
It's nice to be back! :)
<>| Era 16 project - belton spotted tobianos |<> -
I breed risky genes quite frequently and as long as you keep white factor low, in regards to kit patterns, you can breed most combinations with success. This is because the white factor determines if it's lethal, not necessarily the kit genes the foal inherits. Basically, just because a foal gets two lethal kit henes, doesn't mean the foal will die. There is a certsin range, even in the most lethal kit combo, that could produce a live foal. I have pages horses that I bred that are W1,W2,W3,W8,W10,Sb1,Sb2 in various combinations, with and without other white patterns. I calculate the risk using the Lethality chart and decide if the cross is work the risk - less than 25% chsnce, i'll breed them.
However, in combinations that are always lethal (hom frame, hom splash 2, hom splash 3), i make sure only one parent has the gene because 25% is just too high for me.... usually.#28036Thanked by 1Looper -
I only have frame in my mares but I do have a lot of w1 and w2. I am actually focusing on improving my w1/8 line as my foals do well on the pt board for w1. Honestly I just throw them in a pasture and hope for the best. I used to take out the w1and 2 mares and breed them to a less risky stallion but I don't have the time or energy to do that any more.21170
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The lethality chart, and an example of a punnett square can be found in the FAQ/users guide, under the Helpful hints section






















